Again missing the point. My assumption wasn’t that batteries fail at a higher rate than “major components” on an ICE car - it was that if/when the battery fails it’s exponentially more expensive than any component failing on a ICE car.
If you buy a $50k ICE car and the entire engine dies out of warranty (which isn’t what happens generally, just parts of it would), a whole new engine will cost you probably $3k-$4k installed. Battery dies out of warranty on a $50k EV? ~$20k to replace……for a car that’s worth probably $10k by then.
Do you see the difference? One means you literally send the car to the wreckers and have no car, the other means you’re back on the road in the same car a week or 2 later.
You are lowballing the cost of replacing an engine significantly: it MIGHT be as low as $3000, it could be over $10,000. You also are completely ignoring the plethora of moving parts in an ICE vehicle that can fail. The drivetrain in an ICE vehicle contains 2,000+ moving parts typically, whereas the drivetrain in an EV contains around 20. This makes for a massive reduction in maintenance costs over the lifetime of the vehicle, which you also don’t take into consideration in total cost of ownership.
A new engine for a 7+ year old out of warranty car that cost as much as a mass market EV is NOT going to cost you $10k.
And yes, there are more parts in conventional cars, but most parts are cheap to repair/replace. There’s no $20k part that WILL need replacing like there is in a EV. There’s no part that will make your car get less mileage every year.
Saying that on average a EV battery will last you 400k miles for one lol.
There’s also the fact that it will need to be charged more and more frequently the older the car gets, as battery capacity reduces.
Then there’s the fact that one is a twin turbo performance car, the other is a family car.
Also the fact that electricity prices have been absolutely soaring the last few years, with no end in sight, while petrol prices have remained static for years.
I think that’s already been proven, at least in the case of Teslas, that the batteries DO actually last that long on average?
Batteries that lose range but still functioning generally are being swapped out but then sold as house batteries, still incredibly useful and bigger than most house batteries. So they are not a total loss and largely still functioning. Newer battery systems allow swap out of individual cells.
If you look in the comments, someone swapped out the BMW to a cheap ICE car and the Tesla was still cheaper, lol.
I don’t know where you are but electricity prices here have been going down as we add more renewables to the grid - there’s a lot of volatility, but the overall trend is not increasing. State by state there is a huge difference in fuel mix, and wholesale prices generally peak in winter during higher demand. If you are talking about retail prices, you can be smart about that and work out what is best for your use case, I am with Amber which gives direct access to wholesale prices with a flat daily access fee slightly higher than most providers, but my neighbour who was off grid realised they could get much better value especially in winter through one provider with a very cheap overnight rate - they have a Tesla and fairly fast AC charging at home, and makes more sense for them as they drive more than me. I have a second hand EV with an upgraded 30kwh battery that has not really lost noticeable range in the almost 3 years I’ve owned it. Most EV owners have solar, and mostly charge for less or free from home - I’m one of them.
It has not been proven that Tesla and ev batteries last that long on average.
The more renewables that are added to the grid the higher electricity prices go.
Swapping a petrol guzzling twin turbo bmw for a fuel efficient small diesel car will swing the cost calculation significantly favour of the ICE car. EV cars cost significantly more than ICE cars in their segment.
Dude. I’ve provided the receipts with literally every post. You have provided nothing. Give it up already, you are ideologically hamstrung and unable to accept that you are wrong.
Again missing the point. My assumption wasn’t that batteries fail at a higher rate than “major components” on an ICE car - it was that if/when the battery fails it’s exponentially more expensive than any component failing on a ICE car.
If you buy a $50k ICE car and the entire engine dies out of warranty (which isn’t what happens generally, just parts of it would), a whole new engine will cost you probably $3k-$4k installed. Battery dies out of warranty on a $50k EV? ~$20k to replace……for a car that’s worth probably $10k by then.
Do you see the difference? One means you literally send the car to the wreckers and have no car, the other means you’re back on the road in the same car a week or 2 later.
You are lowballing the cost of replacing an engine significantly: it MIGHT be as low as $3000, it could be over $10,000. You also are completely ignoring the plethora of moving parts in an ICE vehicle that can fail. The drivetrain in an ICE vehicle contains 2,000+ moving parts typically, whereas the drivetrain in an EV contains around 20. This makes for a massive reduction in maintenance costs over the lifetime of the vehicle, which you also don’t take into consideration in total cost of ownership.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/sap/2018/09/06/seven-reasons-why-the-internal-combustion-engine-is-a-dead-man-walking-updated/
A new engine for a 7+ year old out of warranty car that cost as much as a mass market EV is NOT going to cost you $10k.
And yes, there are more parts in conventional cars, but most parts are cheap to repair/replace. There’s no $20k part that WILL need replacing like there is in a EV. There’s no part that will make your car get less mileage every year.
Where is this guy egregiously wrong, in your opinion?
https://www.reddit.com/r/electricvehicles/s/Lk7fWVIEVX
Saying that on average a EV battery will last you 400k miles for one lol.
There’s also the fact that it will need to be charged more and more frequently the older the car gets, as battery capacity reduces.
Then there’s the fact that one is a twin turbo performance car, the other is a family car.
Also the fact that electricity prices have been absolutely soaring the last few years, with no end in sight, while petrol prices have remained static for years.
I think that’s already been proven, at least in the case of Teslas, that the batteries DO actually last that long on average?
Batteries that lose range but still functioning generally are being swapped out but then sold as house batteries, still incredibly useful and bigger than most house batteries. So they are not a total loss and largely still functioning. Newer battery systems allow swap out of individual cells.
If you look in the comments, someone swapped out the BMW to a cheap ICE car and the Tesla was still cheaper, lol.
I don’t know where you are but electricity prices here have been going down as we add more renewables to the grid - there’s a lot of volatility, but the overall trend is not increasing. State by state there is a huge difference in fuel mix, and wholesale prices generally peak in winter during higher demand. If you are talking about retail prices, you can be smart about that and work out what is best for your use case, I am with Amber which gives direct access to wholesale prices with a flat daily access fee slightly higher than most providers, but my neighbour who was off grid realised they could get much better value especially in winter through one provider with a very cheap overnight rate - they have a Tesla and fairly fast AC charging at home, and makes more sense for them as they drive more than me. I have a second hand EV with an upgraded 30kwh battery that has not really lost noticeable range in the almost 3 years I’ve owned it. Most EV owners have solar, and mostly charge for less or free from home - I’m one of them.
https://www.aer.gov.au/industry/registers/charts/quarterly-volume-weighted-average-spot-prices-regions
It has not been proven that Tesla and ev batteries last that long on average.
The more renewables that are added to the grid the higher electricity prices go.
Swapping a petrol guzzling twin turbo bmw for a fuel efficient small diesel car will swing the cost calculation significantly favour of the ICE car. EV cars cost significantly more than ICE cars in their segment.
Dude. I’ve provided the receipts with literally every post. You have provided nothing. Give it up already, you are ideologically hamstrung and unable to accept that you are wrong.
You haven’t provided receipts, you’ve provided baseless pro-EV guesses and terribly inaccurate guesstimates.
You still can’t accept that buying a second hand EV, especially one out of warranty, is a massive risk.
The market agrees with me. Second hand EV sales, especially out of warranty ones, are immensely unpopular.