Nato members have pledged their support for an “irreversible path” to future membership for Ukraine, as well as more aid.

While a formal timeline for it to join the military alliance was not agreed at a summit in Washington DC, the military alliance’s 32 members said they had “unwavering” support for Ukraine’s war effort.

Nato has also announced further integration with Ukraine’s military and members have committed €40bn ($43.3bn, £33.7bn) in aid in the next year, including F-16 fighter jets and air defence support.

The bloc’s Secretary-General Jens Stoltenberg said: “Support to Ukraine is not charity - it is in our own security interest.”

  • IninewCrow@lemmy.ca
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    4 months ago

    It’s amazing to see how down voted a contrary opinion can be in this subject.

    It’s a little easier to understand if you reversed the situation.

    How would the US react if the Russians supported Mexico in joining a military pact against the US, so that the Russians could build military bases and install short range nuclear weapons in Mexico and point then at the US? What would the reaction be if Russian then spent billions of dollars financing the Mexicans from any kind of military aggression from the US?

    You can’t threaten someone with a gun and not expect them to eventually shoot you.

    It doesn’t matter how anyone feels about my opinion but the more we posture with violence, lies on all sides, anger and an unwillingness to step back and find sensible solutions … the closer we get to nuclear war and the end of civilization.

    • SuddenDownpour@sh.itjust.works
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      4 months ago

      Cuba (country right next to the US) aligned itself with the USSR after Castro’s revolution, and the US has attempted to coup them, invade them, murder their leaders, then sink them in isolation and starvation. I’ve always defended that Cuba had the right of self-determination for their own foreign and domestic policy, and that the US was in the wrong for retaliating against them.

      It would be extremely hypocritical of me to defend that Ukraine has no right to self-determine whether they want to be in a defensive pact or not, and whether they want to join the EU or not, just because a third country would like them not to do so - just as it’s extremely hypocritical of tankies and campists to say that Cuba had the right to choose their own future but Ukraine doesn’t.

    • Carmakazi@lemmy.world
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      4 months ago

      As an American I think that would all be reasonable…if the official US position was that Mexico has no right to exist, the Mexican people should be forcibly integrated into our society as 2nd class citizens, and the US Army was in the process of a “peacekeeping operation” in Mexico to carry all this out.

      For all our flaws, we respect the borders of our neighbors and don’t have irridentist aspirations that belong in the 19th century. Russia is the aggressor here, and they have demonstrated that they have little interest in global peace or human rights, only increasing their sphere of influence.

      Continually rolling over for thugs because it’s what avoids nuclear conflict will only lead to a global order based on thuggery, and it likely won’t even avoid nuclear conflict in the end.

      • IninewCrow@lemmy.ca
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        4 months ago

        I’m no fan of Russia … I’m just stating my opinion because I don’t want to die in a nuclear holocaust because everyone didn’t want to see reason.

        There’s only one country in modern history that has spread global influence and threats in every part of the world, imposed, threatened, created and caused violence everywhere for decades while imposing their financial, political and economic powers on everyone everywhere for all of modern history …

        … and it isn’t the Russians.

        • Transporter Room 3@startrek.website
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          4 months ago

          Ah, There it is, the thing that you ultimately wanted to say but tried to be coy about.

          “America bad”

          And here I thought the topic at hand was Ukraine becoming a NATO member, not AmErIcAn ImPeRiAliSm

          • WanderingVentra@lemm.ee
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            4 months ago

            NATO is an arm of American imperialism so it’s relevant to the article and conversation at hand.

            • Maalus@lemmy.world
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              4 months ago

              So if the US gets out of Nato like Trump promised, what then? It magically disolves because there are no sovereign countries in there? Or is it still an arm of american imperialism and all ze eviilz in the world?

              • WanderingVentra@lemm.ee
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                4 months ago

                It would definitely weaken a ton although I doubt it would immediately dissolve, although its power is heavily based on our leadership and military and anyone who doesn’t see that is pretty naive. Hopefully Europe would help Ukraine enough to make up for us having Trump and probably not helping them anymore, though.

                  • WanderingVentra@lemm.ee
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                    4 months ago

                    It wasn’t a good question nor was it asked in good faith. I answered what I could with some context. It’s like asking if we know the world would have no wars after we got rid of the Nazis and all the evil in the world would disappear. Well, no, obviously not, but that it doesn’t mean it wouldn’t improve things.

                • Freefall@lemmy.world
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                  4 months ago

                  Probably not helping them? You mean against a trump US joining the Russians. The dude really wants us on the evil side of WW3.

                  • WanderingVentra@lemm.ee
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                    4 months ago

                    He could remove aid but I doubt he could convince Congress and the American people to help Russia. Plus, his whole pro-Russia thing with respect to the war has been posed as an isolation thing. Maybe I’m wrong, though. He’s not afraid to be a hypocrite. A Trump candidacy is depressing and I’ve been trying not to dwell on the possibility of it tbh.

    • Kedly@lemm.ee
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      4 months ago

      Sucking Russia off is not a contrary opinion. I’m not going to entertain anyone saying that maybe Russia isnt in the wrong for Invading Ukraine, and maybe the countries providing military support for Ukraine to defend itself are in the wrong for maybe making Russia feel threatened. America does a lot of shit wrong, supporting Ukraine is not one of them in any way.

      edit: added accidentally missed half of sentence

      • CableMonster@lemmy.ml
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        4 months ago

        What if supporting Ukraine just ends in a loss with a hundred thousand more dead people and less territory; would that have made it a mistake to support Ukraine?

        The main issue is that Russia feels that it cant let ukraine join nato, its “the reddest of red lines” and yet they are pushing us toward a direct conflict with russia.

        • SleezyDizasta@lemmy.world
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          4 months ago

          No, the only mistake would be appeasing the dictator by letting him get away with delusional imperialist conquests.

              • CableMonster@lemmy.ml
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                4 months ago

                But they knew from day 1 that Ukraine couldnt win. And now that its obvious to everyone else, what is gained by escallating war, spending billions of dollars and killing hundreds of thousands of people?

                • SleezyDizasta@lemmy.world
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                  4 months ago

                  Everybody thought that Ukraine would fall within a week but it’s been able to go toe to toe with Russia for over two years. Ukraine has every right to defend itself, destroy Russian forces invading it, and join whatever organization it wants. It’s a free sovereign nation. If spending a few billion dollars means we destroy Russia’s capacity to wage war and help Ukraine defend itself, then so be it. Russia can get fucked. They’re the aggressors and they deserve what they’re getting.

    • highduc@lemmy.ml
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      4 months ago

      Propaganda has been turned up to 11 to manufacture consent for this war, it’s no wonder people are so polarized about it.