genocide. Which the Russians also attempt to commit against Ukrainians denying them their right for self–determination, my dear Russian friend.

Thank god Zelensky is not trying to commit genocide on Ukrainians denying them their right for self-determination by forbidding people to leave the country and kidnapping them off the streets 1 by 1 in front of their mothers/wives and sending them to the meatgrinder, am I right, my dear Western friend holding the moral high ground?

Unless it’s auditted and open source then you should assume its spyware.

I do. I use Matrix and recommend it to all my friends.

“Telegram is spyware” was not the original thesis I replied to, it was about “operated by the enemy”.

Sure, what exactly would you like to have a proof for?

I know, right? I was also shocked when I discovered that it’s not just the evil-evil Russia who does the propaganda thing! :)

Is anything I’ve said a lie though? Or maybe misinformation? Or maybe I’m manipulating facts? Or maybe “Russian talking-points” is how you label inconvenient truth that you are not willing to accept? :)

Debunk what I’ve said, show everyone that I’m just a Russian propagandist (or even better - a bot) spreading lies and deceptions!
Ah yeah right, why do that if calling someone a “Russian larper” is a good enough argument for some folks… :)

Thanks, that was an interesting read :)

Of course it doesn’t prove anything (especially that Telegram sends any information about Ukrainians to Russian government!), but at least those allegations indeed have more credibility than the usual “Russia bad”. It also doesn’t say anything about Durov doing something because he had financial problems. And what it definitely doesn’t say is that “Telegram is operated by Russia”.

Yeah, I hear this quite often :)

Every Ukrainian who doesnt want to die for Zelensky is a Russian, yeah yeah yeah heard that one more times than I can count.

Cheers :)

What gives those rumors credibility other than “Russia bad”?

If you have links to some sources with some facts - I’d very much like to read them

Russia literally wants Ukraine wiped out and yet the idiots unable to change an app on their phone because “network effects and habit”

The thing with Zelensky’s propaganda is that externally (with people familiar with the situation only from CNN (or whever you get your information from…)) it works an order of magnitude better than internally… :)

So “idiots” use Telegram because not only they see no threat in it (why would they?), but also because it helps to avoid the very real threat of “lawful mobilization actions” by the government.

Imagine entire country using coms software operated by the enemy.

Do I get it right that you know that

• Pavel Durov (the creator of Telegram) has left Russia after refusing to give government information on Ukrainians during 2014 protests (from his previous project - VK, also used by both people in Russia and Ukraine)
• Russian government’s most extensive blocking campaign/attempt was targeted at Telegram
• Telegram’s headquarters are in UAE

and still somehow make a conclusion that “it is operated by the enemy” (assuming that by enemy you mean Russian government)? I’d like to learn more about this logic :)

but the government is worried that the app is being used as a method of disinformation

Yeah, disinformation…

People just share too many videos of brutal kidnappings and beating of people in broad daylight lawful mobilization actions by conscription officers there.

And what’s even worse, people warn each other about the places where such lawful mobilization actions are taking place today, so that others can avoid them.

Unthinkable, right?

I was talking about this screenshot, I don’t know if it moved further than matrix discussion: https://librejo.monerodevs.org/SyntheticBird/kewbit-drama/raw/branch/main/images/firstmatrix93.png

Maybe I’m missing some details, but from reading the document it seems to me that CCS is 100% at fault here.
If some rando (that’s the impression I have after reading the document, let me know if kewbit actually had some reputation) can show up with some pretty screenshots and get paid without publishing any sources, then I should quit my job and start “exit scamming” CCS on daily basis as it seems easier and pays more… It just shouldn’t work like this, IMHO 🤷
I see Diego suggested a sensible amendment to rule #4 of CCS to prevent this from happening again. What’s the status of this proposal?

If Ukraine is very lucky, it may find another leader of Zelensky’s strength and calibre.

Holy shit this is fucked up.
I wish everyone who thinks like this to actually experience living under a sadistic murderous dictator glorious leader like Zelensky who will kidnap you, your friends, your brother, your father, your son and send you all together into the meatgrinder lead you to victory over the “orcs”…

Those people are truly fucking sadists…

^ That’s btw what happens in Ukraine as well. If you are against dictatorships, or turning a country into a prison, or kidnapping innocent people off the streets to send them to their deaths - you will find at least one [politician] who will say that you are “a Russian” (and therefore it’s morally okay to do whatever to you, as we all know - Russians aren’t humans, they are orcs, right?) :)

(Of course, the longer the dictatorship gets, the less effective this trick becomes…)

Ah, I see :)

Dunno why you consider me self-hating, but OK :)

I’m trying to catch a liberal here, don’t spook them :(

But jokes aside, yeah it is sarcasm. I’m a Ukrainian so I know very well why people don’t want to fight for the slave owning clown with a main character syndrome.

I don’t know why the downvotes, it’s true

Haven’t you heard? Any criticism of Ukraine automatically makes you a Russian bot/propagandist, I’m downvoted for spreading Russian propaganda :)

Ukraine? Desertion? That doesn’t seem credible…

Can someone familiar with the topic please enlighten me on why is this happening?

I remember Zelensky saying “We cannot force people into war with sticks”, so you are telling me that people are joining the army only to desert en masse later? That makes little sense to me…

Don’t they know that if Putin wins they will all be exterminated in his concentration camps, like those poor people in Crimea and Melitopol that orcs have already captured?