so what, did nobody live or work in africa or the middle east or the american southwest or australia or spain or anywhere else where it gets really hot before cars were invented? were people just like “i have stuff to do but it’s too hot to walk, guess i’ll just die”? and then what of people who live in places where it doesn’t do that, which is statistically most people?
also, worth noting that freeways and asphalt create the urban heat island effect, which makes hot places even hotter.
OK, I’ll grant you that this argument was not super well formed on my part. I can say with confidence that trains built the United States, including the places in the southwest that I alluded to, and HSR currently connects Spain to an alarming degree. China and India also have considerable rail networks, though China’s is to my knowledge more modern and in more active development. That being said, the main point I was making is that dense, walkable development was the only option in these places prior to the car, because how else were you going to get around your local area? And people clearly hauled stuff in those days and in those climes. Clearly doing so without a car is possible, if the development patterns allow for it. Those places currently lack those development patterns, and thus that is not an option in those places at this time, but that’s a result of policy decisions made by leaders in those areas (and the auto industry).
Now, you might protest when I bring up Switzerland that Switzerland is small. And in terms of geographic area, you’re not wrong. But Switzerland is also ferociously mountainous, and much of their rail network had to be tunneled under the Swiss Alps. Connecting LA to San Francisco via the Central Valley with HSR, like CAHSR is doing, is considerably easier than connecting two much closer cities in Switzerland with regular-speed trains was prior. The same goes for:
is applying the same principles in the birthplace of taking a nap in the afternoon because it’s too hot to exist. Yes, I can link Wikipedia articles too.
Oh, and also https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Urban_heat_island exists in deserts too. It’s not that it’s an “island of heat” surrounded by pleasant temperatures, it’s that whatever temperature is around it, the paved/urbanized area is hotter. And this is exacerbated by current suburban development patterns, again, even in deserts.
![[meme] Trains are 100000x easier to electrify and automate than cars, so why does everyone keep talking about electric and driverless cars?](https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/11c37658-7c32-4cc2-b12c-6ced348bd09d.png){kind=link}
so what, did nobody live or work in africa or the middle east or the american southwest or australia or spain or anywhere else where it gets really hot before cars were invented? were people just like “i have stuff to do but it’s too hot to walk, guess i’ll just die”? and then what of people who live in places where it doesn’t do that, which is statistically most people?
also, worth noting that freeways and asphalt create the urban heat island effect, which makes hot places even hotter.
And they have cars in those places.
Before cars were invented we had horses.
you can be generally certain that i’m aware of that
…and trains.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/African_Union_of_Railways
ya they really connected every place in africa.
OK, I’ll grant you that this argument was not super well formed on my part. I can say with confidence that trains built the United States, including the places in the southwest that I alluded to, and HSR currently connects Spain to an alarming degree. China and India also have considerable rail networks, though China’s is to my knowledge more modern and in more active development. That being said, the main point I was making is that dense, walkable development was the only option in these places prior to the car, because how else were you going to get around your local area? And people clearly hauled stuff in those days and in those climes. Clearly doing so without a car is possible, if the development patterns allow for it. Those places currently lack those development patterns, and thus that is not an option in those places at this time, but that’s a result of policy decisions made by leaders in those areas (and the auto industry).
Now, to provide an actual counterexample:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rail_transport_in_Switzerland
Now, you might protest when I bring up Switzerland that Switzerland is small. And in terms of geographic area, you’re not wrong. But Switzerland is also ferociously mountainous, and much of their rail network had to be tunneled under the Swiss Alps. Connecting LA to San Francisco via the Central Valley with HSR, like CAHSR is doing, is considerably easier than connecting two much closer cities in Switzerland with regular-speed trains was prior. The same goes for:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shinkansen
as well as the broader system of
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rail_transport_in_Japan
and, as I alluded to,
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rail_transport_in_Spain
is applying the same principles in the birthplace of taking a nap in the afternoon because it’s too hot to exist. Yes, I can link Wikipedia articles too.
Oh, and also https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Urban_heat_island exists in deserts too. It’s not that it’s an “island of heat” surrounded by pleasant temperatures, it’s that whatever temperature is around it, the paved/urbanized area is hotter. And this is exacerbated by current suburban development patterns, again, even in deserts.