For instance, Assassin’s Creed Origins had subtitles turned off by default and 60% of players turned them on.
Since I started playing (and watching stuff) with subtitles, I realised just how much I’ve missed from poor sound mixing.
As a non-native English speaker it’s quite reassuring that native speakers (I assume?) don’t understand everything either.
For Video games subtitles are ok. But with movies, I have them. They are too diszracting for me so I read subtitles all the time instead of watching the movie. If I wanted to read a book, I would read a book…
I have them on as some accents are just really hard to understand for me. Also, when I eat while watching a movie I miss half the stuff^^
Poor sound mixing is exactly why I watch most things with subs by default now. I got sick of constantly having to turn the volume up to hear dialogue and then quickly back down to avoid massive explosions etc.
And I feel this is an escalating problem. Sound mixing is generally horrible in both games and movies/TV. Unless you blow out your speakers during the higher peaks, you’ve got no chance of hearing dialogue.
Does anyone have any clue to why this is such a well-spread phenomenon? Why is it like this? I mean, I get it (kinda) at a cinema, but I think it’s way overplayed there as well.
Part of it is they are mixed in professional environments (studios) for professional environments (cinema).
Part of it is they can’t mix for someone with a 10 year old tv using its built in speakers in a shared living room with street noise, 15 feet from the sofa and a brand new TV through a sound bar in a rural mansion 8 feet from the sofa, and someone using airpods over Bluetooth.
Plus people tend to listen to things at a volume similar to conversational level, but in a cinema you listen to things at a volume that would be considered impolite to your neighbors if you did it in an apartment block.
Finally, sound engineers are artists and dynamics (louder and quieter parts) are part of their craft. Actors are artists and their vocal performances also have dynamics.
A question to ask yourself is have you considered more actively participating in the sound delivery methods of your media? I’m not here to say “all people are watching TV wrong!” but I would ask if most people have even thought carefully about their sound delivery choices, their own EQ settings in their TV, how well tuned their environment is for active listening, and if they just need to turn their volume up?
I appreciate not everyone can blaze the sound on max — but if you do have to sacrifice some volume, maybe part of that tradeoff is clarity of dialogue?
You say this like there aren’t plenty of movies and shows that don’t have this problem at all, even YouTubers generally knock this out of the park.
Dialogue is one of the only things that should always be clear, it exists to tell the story and missing critical parts of that because they can’t be assed to make sure it sounds half decent in more than one specific environment using one specific audio technology is not something I’m willing to support.
Even in theaters, however, the sound mixing in Tenet was way off. And that may be bad setups at the theaters, but the fact that the complaint was so widespread indicates that the blame likely rests elsewhere.
depends on you see it in imax or in a 20 year old cinema.
it was mixed for imax.
.
Nolan is just partially deaf imo. Dynamic Range is nice and especially for the 5.1 mix it’s great. Still dialogue should be understandable and at least be mostly mixed to the center channel so I can boost it if I want.
Also the 2.1 mix needs to focus on dialogue. No one who watches in 2.1 cares for the dynamic range and subbass stuff imho.
I’m not saying they need to mix for everyone, but how hard is it to make a decent 2.1 channel mix? That would cover 99% of the people complaining with minimal effort.
It seems tv audio engineers expect everyone to have a high end theater speaker setup: that’s the only way to be able to hear it, apart from to use headphones, which is cheaper, but it’s not a great solution. You’d think apps like netflix and Disney plus would be able to include a setting like video games that selects a different audio mix, or separate tracks for dialogue and sfx each with thier own volume slider.
For films, you have idiots like Christopher Nolan who’s head is so far up his own ass he can probably see daylight. He purposefully mixes the audio poorly so nobody can hear anything, and likes it that way because … something something something immersion artsy bullshit. I couldn’t even finish watching Tenet, we turned it off halfway through because we had zero clue what was going on, and I will refuse to ever watch another Nolan film after that.
For games, I think it’s just poor mixing, I doubt they mean to do it on purpose. They just don’t invest in the proper audio people.
I honestly am a huge Nolan fan but could not agree more with his audio lately. I was really frustrated in the theater during Dunkirk trying to figure out what the heck Tom Hardy was saying. Tenet, at times, was also pretty bad. I still really liked both movies, but they would have been better experiences if I could have not dedicated so many resources to hear a word in a garbled mess of voice.
Nolan movies are meant to be loud. Obnoxiously loud. I saw Dunkirk in 70mm IMAX and it was punishingly loud, and amazing.
Basically, Nolan movies can’t be watched in any shared or multi-unit living situations. You need to crank them to “this is going to piss off the neighbours” volume. But that’s specific to the types of movies he makes, which are experiences more than narratives.
I am also pretty sure he has major hearing loss and nobody wants to tell him.
I hate Nolans films because of this
Interesting, I thought the sound mixing in films was poor because it was designed for cinema viewing and then not optimised for home setups. But I don’t watch many movies on the big screen anymore. I thought at least some people were enjoying good quality mixing haha
This is why I think dynamic range compression should be a standard feature for TVs, phones, stereos, PCs and other consumer devices that output audio. Something to even out quiet dialogue and loud explosions would be a godsend for movie watchers everywhere.
I know Windows has a compressor of sorts built in, the audio equalization feature, and I wish there were a good equivalent for this on Linux.
Truth be told, with my auditory processing issues, I’d probably still be using subtitles in tandem with compression/equalization if it were an option. BUT, it’d still be nice to have for watching things late at night without waking other people up.
Funnily enough, watching TV in bed is the other reason I started watching with subs! I’ve since switched to bluetooth headphones for that and I find I don’t usually need subtitles if I’m using them.
Now think about all the visual stuff you’re missing while reading subtitles.
This feels like a self report on having really bad reading speed than like an actual criticism of subtitles
Huge agree. If I can watch Redline and Dead Leaves in their original language with English subtitles first and miss nothing when compared to watching the English dub after the fact, I think I can catch pretty much whatever most movies will throw at me just fine.
As if my ADHD ass could choose to only pay attention to the subtitles anyway?
It’s like reading a road sign while driving on the freeway. I can read the sign out of my peripheral vision, without focusing on it or taking my eyes off the road. I assumed everyone did this?
I don’t have to actually read them slowly, its like an extra thing giving me information. Like seeing words and hearing them in one go. It’s not distracting in the slightest
Doesn’t apply to everyone.
Where it does apply, you got an excuse for a second viewing.
Plus if we’re talking about games, you generally should have some awareness of your surroundings even when watching subtitles. If you didn’t, just paying attention to your UI while playing would be difficult.
You don’t. In The Netherlands we always watch with subtitles in theaters and at home for foreign movies/series (and sometimes even Dutch due to the mixing issues and trying to eat snacks ;) ). You read these without looking a them directly.
I turn them on because I don’t live alone. My family can and will barge in without consideration or pause. So subtitles or headset is mandatory.
Accessibility helps everyone
I turn them on because if I don’t I ADHD blank out and miss things. It helps engage multiple senses which helps my focus.
I always have subtitles turned on for games. Audio processing isn’t my strong suit at the best of times, let alone when fantasy accents and weird vocabulary end up involved. I usually end up using them for TV shows and movies as well, at least when watching by myself. I just wish real life came with them, haha.
I can’t imagine gaming without them, and I wished all devs went the extra mile to include subtitle scaling/ sizing.
I tend to watch everything I can with subtitles these days, watching old stuff again it’s amazing just how much I was missing, either through sound design issues or just zoning out momentarily. The only issue is when the subtitles get ahead of the dialogue and you end up with a bit of a spoiler, albeit only by a few seconds.
I’ve also discovered some absolute gems of sounds/music being subtitled, one of my favourite ever being from the TV show Taskmaster, the sound effect of [he strums balalaika tunelessly], which added so much more than just hearing him strum tunelessly did.
The only issue is when the subtitles get ahead of the dialogue and you end up with a bit of a spoiler, albeit only by a few seconds.
This is the only real criticism of subtitles that I’ll agree with, since you’ll sometimes have a joke juimed because you’ll read ahead of the dialog, but I’ll take that any day over missing bits of story or jokes and either repeatedly rolling back to try to hear/understand something (and ruining the experience) or just not enjoying what I’m watching.
Apparently I’m in the minority here.
Subtitles drive me insane, and I always turn them off. My eyes always get drawn to the subtitles so I miss what’s happening onscreen. I also read faster than the dialog is spoken, but my brain gets interrupted by the spoken dialog while it’s processing what I just read, so I get the same information twice but struggle to retain the actual meaning. I have no idea how anyone can tolerate subtitles unless they actually need them.I always turn on subtitles because I’m born deaf.
Seems like a good reason
I hate how they’re almost always off by default and you usually can’t turn them on until after the opening scene. I have them on whenever possible for both games and watching TV.
This has definitely gotten better in recent years. You can almost date games by whether they have subtitles by default or if they provide some prompted settings for that sort of thing on first boot of the game.
IMO every game on first launch should solicit these options:
- resolution
- vsync
- subtitles
- brightness
- colorblind/accessibility options
Most times going into settings are to change one of those options, so why not quickly let the player set them all at once on the get-go? There’s a 99% chance at least one of those options will need to change for the player/machine needs.
+ volume
I have them turned on since I am not a native english speaker and want to understand everything correctly.
